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259 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
My nightmare of low quality and than Broken and lost H2/H2R Carbon Full Kit Wings!
How to deal with it?
Would you accept it?

IF you write a company... asking of the quality of their parts.
You would be happy like me if they promise you the highest quality on the market!

IF you bought this parts for 2.1K$ from them via paypal you show throug your order your trust in this work/company like i did!

IF you payed fee/taxes of your Country may youre shocked like me, how exepnsive imports are but you pay couse your dream is your dream!

IF you take this parts home to check them you are happy like a child...
IF this "quality parts" are in such a bad quality/condition that you can cry you are shocked again, like me!

IF you send some photos of this parts to the Company/Dealer you are happy that they
promise to refund you when they get the parts back, the expensive post/parcel insurance for damaged parts will may refunds low quality too... I dont know!

IF you send this parts back to them (like they wish) you make a checklist whats inside for the company and the fee/tax institutions and you protect every goodie in this box well for the long travel. Photos and the postal staff can help you to check everything... Like i did!

IF you did what your dealer/company want you will be happy if this nightmare is over soon!

IF you are fallowing the tracking ID of your awesome protected parcel you still waiting that it arrives in hope that you get your anwers and informations of this damaged parts.
The big WHY and what the f### in my head was always in my head!

IF you see in the tracking ID that the parts arrived but the delivery failed from day to day.. You become nervous like me.
Couse if the parcel comes back you payed alot of Money and time for free!
To start again!

IF the Company says that the parcel was taken from the postal Office and they saw it was crashed like sh.... You are shocked again and all becomes to much!
I canceled my order like other people to get refund and say never again!

IF the company tolds you that the Parts are broken now and some of them still lost.
IF they dont refund you full like they claimed, couse now they say,some parts are missing in this crashed damaged parcel.
You become Crazy and mad like me!

IF you call the post DHL and they say that the international profesional Dealer/the Company needs to show the parts the postal offices in their country to proof this case....
IF the international dealer tolds you that nobody cant help there...
If you cant do nothing from your land now?

You will lose the trust in the World and trades like me!

If the dealer refunds you finally with 1.3K€ from 2.4K€ that you payed.

you ask yourself, after this punch has hit you: is this the reality and way of trading today?

IF you have Problems with your Family coused of your loss of 1100€ in this Story you cant sleep like me!

What would you Do in this case?
were no promised shipping insurance helps or refunds you!?
Were you only did what the Dealer wanted from you
Were no 100% refund takes place but you shipped ALL ORDERD parts BACK!
Were the Dealer told you he cant do anything for you couse the Post doesnt know what they can do!
Were the tracking ID shows you that the parcel didnt arrived on the normal way until today!
Were you actually dont know what you can or cant believe anymore!

Would you be happy with a loss of (1100€)and to have a few coins 1300 from 2400) back?
Would you accept it?
Would you say a 100% refund is necessary in this case?

May you can help me and may a few of you are dealers too and can give me a small advice how to deal with it...

Its such a big story and so much email Traffic i cant explain all and everyting!
My english is not the best but i will learn and learn and learn to have a great conversation to all the bike loving people out there!
But me and my Family are very sad how this wing dream becomes a nightmare!
May you can help me or you can learn from me


674 Posts
Was the package insured ?
Whole things sounds dodgy dont give up
anyone on here have enough legal experiance to offer any tips ?
Any recourse through your payment method ? Paypal or credit card ?

211 Posts
can you name the company as for your misfortune that I feel for you, you may save someone else trusting the supplier.

What was wrong with the wings. Did you take photos of damage etc.

765 Posts
I'm sorry to hear you are having these problems, I really hope someone can help. I know PayPal has buyer protection so you should contact them first to see what they will do. If it's the company I'm thinking then I'm a little worried as I just ordered gears and velocity stacks.

259 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 · (Edited)
Hi guys thank you that you listen and try to help even when my Language is not the best.

I ordered the wings from Pierre/ BearRacing
It was a full carbon wing Kit 6pieces
2-Upper wings with gloss/clear coating problems and a 30mm scar at the edge
2-bottom wings with clear coating Problems and broken,pressed, edges
2-wheelwings in Black with symetric problems from above. The rivermark symbol was not quality like but this was the smallest Problem.
Payed via paypal on the BR web shop

My bike was a project for bike shows and showrooms, i planed to go with it on the Track.
But while/after this nightmare it was enough for me and i sold it, to make a cut!
Such a wonderfull machine, but at the end, while i opened my garage it reminds me on this laimed quality h2r part lie!
i was sooooo unhappy with this carbon wings project of my carbon H2.
IF i bought the h2R before i wouldnt had problems with fake quality Parts.

BR warned me (not friendly) that if i talk about this story and if they will make loss of Business/orders, based of my opinion/feedback or what ever pierre L.
Means may it becomes to a problem for me.

This is not a joke!
May i will post this unfriendly advice for you so you can Tell me what it means, in free countrys!?
I will see if they stop now the 1300€ refund based on my position in this bad story/deal/dream!
But to be honest this story destroyed the winter season and family times and i fear nothing when something hits my loved family harder than me!
So BR got all from me, my wings, my money what can i lose?
I lose the energy and Love for my H2 project

I dont hide anything, all emails are recorded to proof that the Deal, the Communications and the rest was legal, payed, shipped, and re BR wished from good coustumers.

I dont have pictures of the re shipped wings, that arrived in south africa, all i got is a photo of my bended parcel and the claim that they cant do more for me than a refund of 1300€ or 4 fixed broken wings.
1300€ are a rain drop of a hot steelbar.

All i wanted was to be a happy costumer and i wanted After this bloody cut after bloddy cut Nightmare was my Money back. couse nobody would be interested in 4 piece repaird/fixed wings.
I dont know how much wings will reach Germany again, if BR would send them (4wings) back.
May i had today 2 fixed wings and a bigger loss!!!

The big questions are:
Were is the claimed south african BR dealer insurance now for LOST/broken parts,that was claimed more than one Time from BR?
Were is the profesionality in Business if the dealer cant do nothing for his costumers from his country were the parcel arrived?
Is the problem Management so Bad?
Or is money, risks and and and more than a happy costumer?
Were are the postal offices that still tracking parcels in SA?
Why took international trading dealers "broken" parcels from the post home and dont show the post staff this crap in the office ?
And and and

Im happy that pierre and my person stayed in contact again, after the big refund debat and the Mails with "i dont understand Bad or die"!

the conversation stoped a few weeks ago, couse i asked him if i will need a lawyer for this case? And i asked them (BR) what Pierre would do in my position.
i tryed to call BR several times mailbox included but they blocked me for several days,
After this kiddy crap we found a new Level to Talk,
I begged him to contact the post offices to find my "lost wings" couse my shipping was insured with 500€ I
F something is going wrong while shipping.
The DHL insurances does exist its not only a word!
The Last Information a few days ago was:
BR cant do nothing for me couse DHL says this and the other post Office there called EMS says that...
Ive send him a web link from ebay were they show how dealer needs to refund costumers...

What i Know is dhl in Germany cant do nothing from Germany for me, couse the parcel is claimed in south africa and the Tracking ID shows a uncompleted delivery, couse BR catched the parcel out of the post way...
But they get the parcel,i got a photo of this! They get it from the postal office not in the normal tracked way?!?

This Story is more than unprofessional and the payed victim is me and my family...
I dont get my tax back and i dont get my payed money back
May he will stop the refund of 1300€ too couse i post this Story as a review on social media (the warning is recordet in my Mails for this case it fallows soon)

I know dealers that would send you your Money back or they send you a the quality products that you ordered again to make costumers happy.
But this eat or die experience is so hard to believe for me and my Family that hurts very bad

1,179 Posts
Take it up w/ your credit card company or open up a PayPal dispute. You have photos of the wings that weren't "as described" & you have proof that you mailed back the product & according to the venders emails he received the product back. Additionally you may want to file a claim w/ DHL.

PayPal Buyer Protection
If an eligible item that you’ve bought online doesn’t arrive, or doesn’t match the seller’s description, PayPal's Buyer Protection may reimburse you for the full amount of the item plus postage. Buyer Protection can cover your eligible online purchases, on eBay or on any other website, when you use PayPal. Conditions apply.

More about Buyer Protection.
For more information on the specific terms of the Buyer Protection applying to you, see our User Agreement.
What's Covered?
Physical goods that can be posted and which do not violate PayPal policies. Here are a few examples of situations where an item doesn’t match the seller’s description: You bought a book and got a DVD, you bought a new item but got something that was used, you bought 3 items but only got 2, the item was damaged during delivery, the item is missing major parts (that the seller didn’t disclose), or you purchased an authentic brand but got a fake instead.

What's not Covered?
Intangible items like services, real estate, motorized vehicles (of any kind), custom made items, travel tickets, industrial machinery (for manufacturing), prepaid or gift cards, anything you buy in person, or items that violate PayPal's policies or eBay’s policies. You must open a dispute within 180 days or you will not be covered.

General Guidelines.
Disputes can be opened for certain, tangible and physical goods only
Full item cost has to be covered in one payment
The buyer can open a dispute within 180 days of the date the payment was made
If the buyer and the seller cannot reach a mutual agreement, the dispute can be escalated to a claim within 20 days after opening the dispute
Buyers cannot open several disputes for the same payment

If an item doesn’t arrive or doesn't match the description, and your payment is eligible, we’ll reimburse the full cost of eligible purchases paid, including shipping costs.

206 Posts
Exactly why I will not be purchasing a set of those wings. If I'm not mistaken they are just 3D Printed pieces that are way overpriced in the first place. If I wanted H2R wings I would just buy the real ones direct from Kawi or buy an H2R. I doubt at this point if you will be able to get more money back but its worth a shot. Good luck

259 Posts
Discussion Starter · #15 · (Edited)
So guys the last stand was that the dealer doenst know what he can do in south africa couse this post office says go there and the other one says go there and and and

If i would be a dealer I would run for my costumers...
I talked to DHL today they was very angry couse BearRacing has to know how a reclaim for costumers has to work.
Normaly you need a reshipping coupon from the Dealer this post way is different.
Now i did all and everything to have nothing in the hands couse I did what the dealer told me...

Normaly the time frame is 7days to show the post office whats damaged or lost to get refund but now this time is over!!

So I cant actually and finally do nothing from here!
I dont have pictures of the "broken" content all is in South Africa!

Funny is this from the South African DHL site: DHL | FAQs | English

Look whats under the point: COMPLAINTS!
Seems to be easy but seems to be a mountain lift at the same time there!

I wrote this company today again we will see what I get served now!

Until today no money in my hand, no pictures of the broken wings, no quality full wing kit like I orderd some month ago...

259 Posts
Discussion Starter · #16 · (Edited)
Answere with big?

So updated by the answere that i get...
The wings are fixed/repaired now and nobody from the post can see the damaged parts anymore.

It becomes better and better
The promised refund of 1500$ was actually 1300€ couse they refunds me via paypal consumer payment (but I'm not a dealer and I dont sold something to BR?!?!?) I had to pay 80$ PayPal fee and the $ to € regulations to activate a refund...
Until today the money stays with paypal and its not free to use...
My wish was a refund/payment via friend to friend but they told me they pay like I payed them
lol its to sad for laughing

Now they say it was the final payment/ refund for that parts that arrived...
My wish that they do the paper stuff for dhl for the lost or broken parts is not longer any theme!
The dhl insurance was up to 500€ for damged and lost parts NOW ITS NOTHING COUSE THEY CLAIMED NO ONE KNOWS HOW TO HANDLE CASES LIKE THAT DOWN UNDER????

Like I said all I wanted was:
Quality wings
And after this nightmare
My refund of order and the tax
Or the refund the money from the dhl insurance and my tax/fee from the german Institutions for taxes....

Always a new tale from SA


406 Posts
I bought the lower wings from Activemoto. Great quality/finish/fit, came extremely well packaged and the customer service is great. For me it's the best choice if you really want wings.


If you don't mind my asking what did you pay in US dollars for them ?


259 Posts
Discussion Starter · #20 · (Edited)
Paypal purchase protection for buyers is a great service to prevent this nightmares!

My project partner wrote this company today via paypal to give them a new option for refund!

After I heard that my DHL insurance for the reshipped parts is gone couse BR wasnt showing them to the post before they fixed them I was shocked again!

My planing of a good will was that BR send me a refund of 1500$ via PayPal as friend to friend with a short text that this is the refund... And I told them that they need to bring the low quality parts and the parcel to the post so my DHL insurance can refund me up to 500€ for the lost and damaged parcel parts!

Now this idea is gone couse like I said: it seems to be a crazy tale
First they wanted the parts back to check them and to refund me
Than they claimed the parts are lost and the parcel was damaged
Than they said they cant refund me anymore
Than after a long and story of talking and asking
They like to refund me 1500$ my please was via friend to friend!
They told me that they will do anything to activate the post in SA for the DHL insurance
And today the told me its not possible couse they fixed the parts yet...

Whats going on there? I was reading alot of jaleels costumer problems but whats going on there with the awesome H2 part builders in SA ?

If I would change the positions with Pierre what would he do?
This was always my question!
Would he or anyone Take the eat or die ->1300€ from 2500€ couse people claimed the unseen parts are lost?
Would / you or anyone beliefe the story of a dealer who doenst know how to deal with Broken parcels?
That claimed that no post station can help there?
This **** makes me sick
Why try people to act like this?
For a few hundred euros from one hard working guy?
My "refund" was transfered like a deal or service that I have to serve so I dont have this money just in time...

All I want is quality parts like I ordered and like they promised me or my money back couse again I did all what they wanted from me photos reshipping and and and
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