Aftermarket SC bolts issue - fix ? - Page 4 - Kawasaki Ninja H2 Forum
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post #31 of 88 Old 11-30-2017, 03:47 PM
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Originally Posted by ayjayef View Post
So if you only do mostly lefthand corners it gets tighter?

Surely leaning the bike has sweet FA to do with the bolt coming out and if the original factory gear doesn't have the problem then the issue is either:
* the type or application of loctite
* chain tensioner alignment
* or most likely, the loose fit of the early supercharger gears.
Not so fast.....

The gravitational forces applied while leaning and accelerating exaserbates the problem of poor fitment. It doesn't necessarily have to be a right-hander either


There was no issues with my installation. I did not skimp on replacing the bolts and washers with new ones. Additionally, I was the one who originally went on record suggesting the High Temp loctite in the first place vs. High strength that was being commonly used. .....And also went against the Green Loctite that Ricky G. Suggested in his installation instructions. I managed a whole year without it coming lose. (Edited: More like 8 months) Impressive, but not cured completely.

The gears that I have are not the early version of the gears either. Mine are actually very tight to slide on the shaft.

Last edited by Turbo329; 11-30-2017 at 03:54 PM.
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post #32 of 88 Old 11-30-2017, 03:54 PM
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Originally Posted by kawah2 View Post
How often do you check yours, every month, three months or oil change?
Prior to it coming loose the 2nd time, I hadn't checked it in about 8 months. Installed November 2016 (My YouTube video for reference) and it came loose in July 2017 (my Facebook live post at the track for reference).

I recommended that it is checked every 1000-1500 street miles, every 600 hard track miles (6 track days roughly), or every 30 passes at the drag strip. Drag Strip guys should be pulling their clutch anyways periodically. lol
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post #33 of 88 Old 11-30-2017, 03:55 PM
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Someone should take one of these lower gears and put it in a hot-azz oven to measure how much it is expanding when hot.
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post #34 of 88 Old 11-30-2017, 04:58 PM
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If it's made of steel, it will expand at the same rate as the shaft ... Common steel alloys have little difference in coefficient of expansion, and all the oil splashing around will make sure the sprocket and the shaft are very close to the same temperature ...
rapidroy1 and Boosted10R like this.
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post #35 of 88 Old 11-30-2017, 08:28 PM
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@Turbo329

"The gravitational forces applied while leaning and accelerating exaserbates the problem of poor fitment. It doesn't necessarily have to be a right-hander either"

Please tell me you arent implying that gravity, which is a constant, is amplified when someone is turning or leaning.

NOLA
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post #36 of 88 Old 11-30-2017, 08:49 PM
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Even if centrifugal force were the theory, if the Bear setup is so marginal that were it not for centrifugal force making the bolt "weigh" twice as much which is just a few more grams, it would hold, but with the few more grams it backs out: That would be too marginal to be considered a proper job.

Last edited by trenace; 11-30-2017 at 11:49 PM.
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post #37 of 88 Old 11-30-2017, 10:53 PM
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Garage
The list of things that can cause the bolt to break or come loose after it is properly torqued and lock-tite-ed is very short. Lets put aside centrifugal force unless the gear or bolt is radically out of balance.
So what can be happening?
The fitment of the gear to the shaft is poor, that would cause the head of the bolt to try to move in relation to the shaft(and threads) and over time that movement will try to force the bolt loose.
The bolt is stretching from the torque and weakens and any slop in the shaft to gear will cause the bolt to work and eventually break.
If the gear is too thin and the bolt is tightening against the shaft and the gear is free to move, beating the crap out of the bolt.
For the most part it sure looks like the fitment of the gear to the shaft is poor and working the bolt. There are chemicals like loctite that can be used to take up that slack. It may be worth doing.
I am very interested in this because a good way to compensate for the high altitude I live at is to re-gear the SC.
One question I have is when people say they properly torqued the bolt, I tend to wonder what torque wrench they used? The lighter the torque the more inaccurate the torque wrench gets, especially cheap torque wrenches. When it comes to torque wrenches I am a Snap-on fanatic.And when it comes to torque accuracy the middle range of the wrench is the most accurate, hence the different size wrenches. 15 ft lbs is not very much and needs a good wrench.
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post #38 of 88 Old 12-01-2017, 09:48 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Turbo329 View Post
Not so fast.....

The gravitational forces applied while leaning and accelerating exaserbates the problem of poor fitment. It doesn't necessarily have to be a right-hander either


There was no issues with my installation. I did not skimp on replacing the bolts and washers with new ones. Additionally, I was the one who originally went on record suggesting the High Temp loctite in the first place vs. High strength that was being commonly used. .....And also went against the Green Loctite that Ricky G. Suggested in his installation instructions. I managed a whole year without it coming lose. (Edited: More like 8 months) Impressive, but not cured completely.

The gears that I have are not the early version of the gears either. Mine are actually very tight to slide on the shaft.
Do you recommend red loctite 262 or 263 or some other one?
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post #39 of 88 Old 12-01-2017, 01:53 PM
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A few thoughts here:

It is very strange for red Loctite, properly applied, to have not only allowed a bolt to back out by itself, but for all traces of it to have disappeared.

Improving on how a factory says to do a thing, or an expert (let's call Ricky Gadson an expert) sometimes can backfire.

What was the prep process?

Are the bolt and what it's going into soft steel, or stainless? Loctite says for stainless their primer is required. In all cases, degreasing must be absolutely thorough.

Additionally, Loctite lists green Loctite as being oil-tolerant. Red Loctite, the table reads N/A, page 9. (I know people do it in other applications and have gotten away with it.)

http://www.wdarc.org/Loctite%20Guide.pdf

For sure at least with earlier gears there was a fitment issue, not merely a Loctite issue, I am not saying otherwise.

Last edited by trenace; 12-01-2017 at 06:23 PM.
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post #40 of 88 Old 12-01-2017, 02:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NOLA View Post
@Turbo329

"The gravitational forces applied while leaning and accelerating exaserbates the problem of poor fitment. It doesn't necessarily have to be a right-hander either"

Please tell me you arent implying that gravity, which is a constant, is amplified when someone is turning or leaning.

NOLA
Yeah this had me leaning in my chair trying to make sure I read it right. So leaning the bike over while accelerating will cause the bolt to back out or break? WTF kinda dope yall smoking round here cause I want some LoL

2016 H2- Motorwork,Brocks Full Slashcut System,Stage 3 Gears,YagerWerx Intercooler,Rotox Boost Wheels,Shorai Lithium Battery,Adams Swingarm,.....etc etc etc

Last edited by EnviedH2; 12-01-2017 at 02:54 PM. Reason: speeling correction
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